Kevin Marshall's America
Patrick Bauntello has publicly vacated his position as blogger for the Animal Rights blog here at the Times Union website, citing too much stress from the criticism.
Which is fine. This isn’t for everyone, and Patrick did receive plenty of unfair comments and ad hominem attacks directed towards him for his stances. However, he also engaged in a regular practice of censoring opposing views on his blog. Which is also fine; it was his blog and his right. He didn’t have to allow comments at all if he didn’t want to. But I felt he should at least just own up to it.
Before going any further, I would like to point you to Libby Post‘s blog. Libby is a person of convictions who dealt with far worse – in terms of criticism and abuse – than Patrick did for his views, both online and especially in real life. How she deals with the criticism and comments versus how Patrick dealt with so much as a simple question about his beliefs speaks volumes, I think, about both individuals.
The main difference between the two? Libby actually takes a pro-active stand and lives what she preaches. That’s always been my issue with Patrick and why I for the most part avoided his blog. Patrick was a vegan and felt strongly on the issues he wrote about, but he still never provided a clear answer as to how he can condemn other people and businesses for engaging in a practice he himself did every day.
Let me explain.
Patrick operates a pizza business. He would condemn and attack other people (and bloggers) for eating meat or keeping animals when he himself owned a business that served and distributed meat, cheese, and other items containing animal byproducts. His defense: “I need the money,” which he himself would NEVER accept as a defense to those at the other end of his arguments. Patrick’s explanation is akin to someone condemning the Nazi persecution of Jews in Germany but running a labor camp, then defending himself by saying “hey, it’s a living!”
Seem like an outrageous and unfair comparison? Well it is, and it’s exactly the type of comparison he himself would make. Now you understand the frustrating comedy of errors that was the Animal Rights blog.
Long story short: Patrick is strong in his beliefs, but God bless him, he’s a pathological hypocrite. Not only for owning the pizza shop, but also for expressing such strong outrage towards individuals whom would disagree with him and infer they are all terrible human beings for not living up to a standard he himself doesn’t own up to while portraying himself as a martyr for the cause of animal rights.
The cross is indeed heavy, and it is too much for one human being to bear. But there’s no cross here; in fact there’s barely a pile of loose lumber to be found.
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32 Responses to The Cross is So Heavy
Leave a Reply to Awesomedude Cancel reply
STALK ME
We should all be quick to listen and slow to condemn. I’m formerly vegan, currently kinda vegetarian, and Little Anthony’s was a lifesaver when I wasn’t eating dairy. However, Mr. Battuello’s blog just wasn’t for me. I hope that someone perhaps a bit more moderate can step up and take over the Animal Rights blog, or something similar in a different incarnation. I was always, like, “I should be all over this blog!” but just couldn’t get behind his style and intensity. Hope he keeps making that yummy vegan food, though! I still love it!
A point, and not a minor one:
Batuello blogged on timesunion.com, as do you, so it wasn’t entirely “his” blog and his “right” to do whatever he wanted, with content or comments. In exchange for access to the audience that comes to timesunion.com, promotion throughout our site and the visibility of being on this platform, bloggers have to follow TU rules. While they have significant discretion, it’s not absolute.
Kevin: I think one can maintain a vegan lifestyle and still sell animal products, but to loudly condemn the use of meat and cheese while
profiting by selling it? That’s wrong, and no amount of rationalization can make it right.
Steve: Thank you for the clarification. The point I was trying to make, I suppose, is that he had more than enough discretion available to him to not approve the sort of unfair and undue personal attacks that he claims he was consistently bombarded with.
Wait….animals have rights? I thought they were just animals…I’m confused.
Where is the LIKE button around here?
You know at 1st I felt bad about him leaving, thinking that maybe a few of my attempts at humor may have added to his stress level. I actually started to post on his blog, an apology of sorts. But then it was lunch time, and I had to eat an entire freaking cow. But it’s ok, he committed suicide.
SAVE THE SOY…..EAT A COW.
GenWar: yes they have rights, not to vote or own land or anything though.
A “Like” button is actually a GREAT suggestion. Hey, Huber! Get on that!
Oh, and:
Animal Rights? More like HUMAN LEFT am I right?!
(really kicking myself for not thinking of this one while I was writing the blog)
I’m just disgusted that I’ve bought so many pizzas loaded with pepperoni, sausage and extra cheese at Little Anthony’s. Won’t be ever again because I’d just feel judged for giving him my money. I’d rather give my money to people who are happy to provide me with what I want in exchange for it and value my commerce.
Leigh, I like your comment. Honestly, I don’t understand vegan/vegetarian but I really don’t care what other people eat or choose not to. Why would I? If more vegans only had the attitute you display, they’d be far less offensive and would possibly be able to do more to eduate.
Fact is, his blog could have been one to educate and inform but he chose to make it his holy war while hypocritically doing what he does for money. I’m not Christian but it does have a creepy Judas-like tone to it. Selling out for 30 pieces of silver. This farewell post could, in fact, be given by Judas. I took the silver so that Jesus could sacrifice himself and save others. That really rubs even a die-hard Atheist like me the wrong way.
In all honesty, I probably wouldn’t ever have read PB’s blog just because it’s not an issue I’m at all interested in had I not run into all this nonsense going from blog to blog. I haven’t even been to your blog yet, Steve, which I occassionally read even though I don’t dine out much. (I like food and sometimes you cross over into other interesting topics.) But I went from Teri’s blog to here and Rob’s and saw such viterol, mostly caused by this man hating on people who weren’t vegan.
I clicked on a couple of the links to his blog and was disgusted by his behavior — which is why I’m also disgusted that I ever contributed to his wealth.
I’ll second Leigh. It would be nice if the TU can find a more moderate (and less hypocritical) voice to do an animal rights blog.
I guess there’s a lesson in this really, though. If you don’t like a fellow blogger, just ignore them. Don’t start a flame war throughout the whole freaking place so that people who don’t even have an interest in your topic are brought into it. Geeze.
In fact, I take back my holy war analogy. We’ve got Christian, Muslim and Jewish blogs on the religious category and, as far as I know (I admit I haven’t read them since I’m none of the above), they’re treating each other peaceably. Let’s hope the TU can get an animal rights representative capable of the same thing. Who can, like they and Libby, show some class.
Human left? Kevin, you started something. You do know I’m so totally going to use that, don’t you?
And also Tony’s save the soy, eat a cow! That’s great.
I am so craving a meat lovers pizza right now!
Ironically, I just had a pizza and, instead of pepperoni, it was topped with little tiny violins.
BL: now that’s funny.
As I wrote on the Barnes blog- I don’t think profiting from the torture and murder of animals while being a vegan makes you a hypocrite. Its virtually impossible to not support the practice somehow living in America and really, most societies.
I think Pat is being hypocritical in regards to that prevalent comment he made about the Alaskan tribe he felt should move so it didn’t need to hunt in order to survive. He is doing the same thing as these Alaskans…
I’m with Leigh that there is opportunity lost here- animal rights has innumerable questions, dialogues and polemics to be had regarding it and these issues are inextricably linked to other spheres- globalization, the food industry, etc.
For a non-vegan (although a vegan once…) who is more than sympathetic to the fact the veganisms argument is largely correct…Pat wasn’t really discussing issues or having discussions…which is what blogging should be for…his blog mirrored the Tom King gun rights blog- both were strident for a narrow ethical view..
Awesomedude – I sort of see what you’re trying to say in the first paragraph, but that’s incorrect for both logistical and practical purposes. It certainly is possible to be vegan, not buy anything containing animal byproduct, and not support – through expenditures or means of employment – a system someone like Pat so vehemently rails against. People do it all the time.
And, actually, it’s hypocritical regardless. What does it matter if he can or can’t?
Let me put forth a scenario to explain. Say I come up to you on the street and we have the following dialogue.
Me: “Hey, Awesomedude! IF THAT IS YOUR REAL CHRISTIAN NAME. You’re a jerk.”
You: “What? No I’m not, I’m awesome!”
Me: “No you’re not. You know why?”
You: “Why?”
Me: “Because you cannot fly. Also, I am better than you, and I am right and you are wrong simply because you can’t fly. You should be able to fly and you don’t. That makes you morally reprehensible.”
You: “But…but you can’t fly either!”
Me: “…well I don’t have a choice in the matter.”
Hypocritical, even though it’s impossible for us to fly.
See?
dude, there’s a world of difference between it being impossible to avoid and actively being a part of causing a thing to be, to promote it and enable it.
A lot of people don’t believe this of someone who came of age in the ’70’s but I don’t like and never did drugs and haven’t even smoked pot. Has my abstaining stopped the practice? Obviously not. I’ll be damned if I tell other people what to do. That’s their decision to make. But, if I did, and sold the crap, would that or would that not make me a hypocrite? Hmmm? You see the difference. It’s one thing if I ignore my friends sparking up a doobie at a party and another thing if I sell it to them while lecturing them on how people really shouldn’t smoke dope.
But I’ll agree with the rest of your post. :) Peace, man.
I believe I can fly….
@2/Steve – Thank you.
I hear what you are all saying. A hypocrite is a hypocrite. However…if PB’s pizza joint was only vegan friendly it probably would’ve had boards on the windows long ago.
Even still, it doesn’t make his hasty blogging retreat any better and definitely doesn’t justify his bitter bleating.
I guess the moral here is if you are going to don the crest of a crusader…you better do it mind, heart, and wallet.
And Godwin’s Law in one! I’m so proud!! (Not that I disagree with you, I just appreciate a good Godwin’s when I see it. :) )
Someone already mentioned that it can be hypocritical to condemn while you operate a business that promotes the practice of what you condemn. You tend to lose credibility that way. In my opinion, it’s ok to criticize, or even evaluate, something that you believe in, but if you’re going to speak out against it, you’d better be practicing what you preach (wow cliche, but it’s true). I have a harder time siding with someone who talks out of both sides of their mouth, even if I agree with the cause.
Speaking of writing about causes, I should get to writing soon.
As a vegetarian, I’ve found that people rarely ever know that I am one, not because I eat meat in front of them, but because it never comes up. Like most sets of beliefs, it’s better to practice it than to preach it.
My mother always told me “If you don’t have anything nice to say, don’t say anything.”
Sometimes I would reply “But HE started it!!!”
and then I grew up. So Patrick bailed when it got too hot in he kitchen. Lets use the little influence and power we have available to us (a blog) to keep the heat on the poor guy.
It was about setting the record straight. This guy wasn’t being mercilessly attacked like he says he was nor were the bloggers he singled out doing anything of the sort either.
I enjoyed Patrick’s blog. I am an animal lover who is not a vegan or vegetarian. Patrick brought attention to the serious topic of animal abuse. I applaud his efforts to make the world a better place for those who cannot speak for themselves.
Kmarsh- your argument has larger holes than Descartes Ontological argument…
You simply need to add a term onto what the vegan advocates- to not participate in the torture, enslavement, murdering of animals etc- as much as your capable of.
You say there are people who are able to 100% extricate themselves from supporting in any way the non-vegan world- I say name them. Maybe Pat could have given his business away (he couldn’t sell it since that would be profiting from a non-vegan business,) given away his car, house, clothes etc. He could have found a job perhaps at a vegan grocery store (but even then the vegan store has to pay suppliers, truck drivers, some of which will be non-vegan and hence they support the non-vegan world,) beg or scavenge for some all hemp/non-sweatshop clothes etc.
Would this have made his devotion to veganism greater and more passionate- maybe. But your argument is much like how global warming deniers argue against Al Gore. They will say, well Al Gore flies in a plane which wastes gas so anything he says is absolute BS…Al Gore will say he needs to fly in a plane and he donates both his money and life to helping end global warming so it evens out…Pat will say he promotes vegan pizza/gives money to vegan advocacy groups so it evens out etc.
By your logic MLK did not believe in civil equality since he insisted on living in America and he didn’t expatriate.
You’re operating on a logical fallacy, dude. MLK living in the United States is not the same as Patrick running a pizza joint.
Now, if MLK had been running a business that specifically excluded a race of people by his own choice, then yes, he’d be a hypocrite and you (and Patrick) would have a valid argument. But he didn’t and you don’t.
Advocates try to change their environment. King lived in the United States, but believed there should be civil equality so worked to change it and engaged in civil disobedience of what he viewed to be unjust laws. Patrick runs a business that profits from the sale and doesn’t do much. In fact, it’s worse, because Patrick willingly entered into that arrangement. Nobody is holding a gun to his head, nor is he under a legal obligation to run a pizza joint that sells animal byproducts.
Kevin, since I’ve had no interaction with you, I can understand your skepticism. I posted this on Rob’s blog and thought you might be interested:
Rob, Things did get out of hand, and I am not blameless. Perhaps, my thin skin prompted me to act from emotion instead of reason. I understand that when you stake an admittedly extreme position, you should either minimize vulnerabilities (and owning a restaurant is a rather large one) or offer a convincing defense. Obviously, I haven’t convinced some readers. That’s fine. Even though I do not feel that I am being hypocritical (I wish your readers could observe a Friday or Saturday night and fully appreciate the vegan activism at Little Anthony’s), the question remains valid. Also, there has been an unattractive arrogance in some of my articles (“the Eskimos should move” comes to mind). Lessons learned I suppose.
Anyway, I do wish I had answered your initial comment and explained myself better. At the very least, I recognize that until the day I no longer sell meat, I will be open to understandable criticism. I sincerely invite you in for a vegan pizza sometime.
Pat
Pat – thanks so much for chiming in.
It’s certainly tough for us to remove ourselves from a situation enough to look at our actions objectively, let alone to be able to do so after the fact. They say hindsight is 20/20, but in cases of emotional investment, sometime I beg to differ with the cliche.
Like I said and you touched on, I felt your hypocrisy lied not in the stance you took, but in the standards you seemed to hold others up to.
Issues such as these are tricky, in that the emotional nature of them can lead us to often adopt stances and say things we often wouldn’t say or may not necessarily mean. Passion is a wonderful thing to have and necessary in order to elicit the change that we want to see. That said, we have choices: we can set out to try to change people’s minds, let them go on their way and hope that the occasional fact will somehow deter them, or we can simply chastise.
That last one is most prevalent with all of us, because it’s the easiest and most natural.
We’re all human, lessons learned all around. Again, I thank you for taking out the time and hope to one day take you up on your offer.
admittedly a bad metaphor for me and a good point on your end- but-do you think Al Gore is a hypocrite for flying on private jets etc. to promote ending global warming while perhaps contributing to the problem himself? To an extent don’t the ends justify the means? Or because Gore doesn’t own the private jet company himself he is ok?
From Pat’s perspective- perhaps being a business owner and making more money makes him more able to promote his message and pour more money into advocacy?
There is more gray area in the apparent hypocrisy than I believe at first glance…
however, comments that his conscience is 100% clear on everything he does says to me Pat sees his world as starkly black and white as I think you might in this case…I don’t think you can have an entirely clear conscience as a ‘vegan’ and sell meat…but that’s just me…
Interesting question, dude.
I still don’t think it’s QUITE the same thing, and one that I wish was easier to answer. It’s avoidable, I suppose, if he’s willing to ride his bike and row a boat around the world. But I think while the two cases carry with them similar quagmires, they are at vastly different degrees that can’t be ignored. The world would make it impossible for Gore to spread his message and makes those appearances in a timely manner. It doesn’t, however, make it impossible for Pat to make a living. To make a living in the pizza business, yes, but not to make a living in general.
Interesting discussion. Glad I never read his blog. It would have made me angry from what I’ve seen here.